CM Punk participated in the No Kings Protest, Jinder Mahal to tie the knot

https://ohss.dhs.gov/topics/immigration/yearbook/2019/table39

Bill Clinton
Removals Returns
1993 42,542 1,243,410
1994 45,674 1,029,107
1995 50,924 1,313,764
1996 69,680 1,573,428
1997 114,432 1,440,684
1998 174,813 1,570,127
1999 183,114 1,574,863
2000 188,467 1,675,876
2001 189,026 1,349,371

Barack Obama
Removals Returns
2009 379,739 582,567
2010 382,449 471,798
2011 390,423 322,047
2012 415,607 231,107
2013 432,228 178,976
2014 405,090 163,843
2015 325,328 129,661
2016 [3] 331,717 106,458

Donald Trump

Removals Returns
2017 287,093 100,695
2018 328,716 159,940
2019 359,885 171,445
2020 No numbers listed

Removals involve a formal court order and returns do not. Either way, both are deportations.

@Joseph
What does this prove? Is this a bone of contention somehow? To be clear, I have no clue what they’re protesting.

@Luke
The picture of Punk shows two f*-k ICE signs being held. ICE is the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement. Many protestors are protesting the ongoing crackdown on illegal immigration. Not just protesting but there’s been cases of violent attacks against ICE officers.

@Luke,

It’s the method being employed. It’s I.C.E. stalking court houses and detaining people showing up to court to work on their status the proper way. It’s I.C.E. profiling people on the streets and arresting them without a lawful purpose to do so. It’s about an administration inflating it’s deportation numbers by attempting to deport American citizens. All actually happening as we speak. And the very few criminal they are deporting are deported without proper due process.

The result of all of the above are foreign countries telling its citizens not to finish academic pursuits in the U.S., which is going to cause a brain drain that will put America on course to fall behind every other industrialized nation.

Let’s all wish him the best in his future endeavors

@Joseph It’s a good thing you added the data after the link or else a certain account on here would complain about having just a link to click on instead of having it handed to them on a silver platter, figuratively speaking. Good work bringing some much needed context to this subject.

Well, well, well, disrespecting CM Punk again. DB and Joseph are using a new sock puppet named The Truth? Such a shame.

@Disgruntled Jobber
ICE is cracking down. I don’t agree with some of their tactics, but they’re cracking down on not only criminals who are here illegally, but those who overstay their visa, violate the terms of their visa, and so much more.

@Disgruntled Jobber
Yeah, I’m familiar with similar organizations. The end justifies the means and all that crap. Abide by the law, except when we don’t want to. Divide and conquer.

But hey, if I was in the States even legally at this point, I’d go to this ICE voluntarily and lie I’m an illegal. I’m assuming it’d get me a free ticket back home? Or is that not what’s happening in such situations?

@Joseph
I was asking about the numbers you posted.

Tag in Jews for illegal immigrants. Do you perhaps see any parallels between this ICE (exactly as you described it) and the Schutzstaffel? Do you not see an organization that will grow in power astoundingly quickly? An organization that the general population will start to fear? The exact kind of organization you guys have been mouthing off that you need guns to protect yourself against if the government goes rouge?

What will you say when they come for someone who’s in your country legally (i.e. unlawfully) and that someone decides to open fire from a legally owned firearm?

@Luke

“I was asking about the numbers you posted.”

The numbers I posted were the total deportations for each year. During Bill Clinton’s two terms as President his administration deported over 12 million.

“Tag in Jews for illegal immigrants. Do you perhaps see any parallels between this ICE (exactly as you described it) and the Schutzstaffel?”

Can you even compare the two? Illegal immigrants are in another country illegally. This is why they are called illegal immigrants and being deported. What happened to the Jewish people, especially before, during, and after the Holocaust is not the same. The Reich Citizenship Law declared that only those of “German or related blood” could be Reich citizens. Jews, defined by the Nazis as a separate race, were explicitly excluded from this classification. Instead, they were relegated to the status of “state subjects” and denied full political rights. Even though they were stripped of their rights, I believe they were still citizens and not illegal immigrants.

“What will you say when they come for someone who’s in your country legally (i.e. unlawfully) and that someone decides to open fire from a legally owned firearm?”

I’m confused by this one. You say legally, but then in parentheses you say unlawfully. If they are here legally, how can they be here unlawfully? Either way, to answer the question I simply don’t know. I guess it would depend on the circumstances surrounding the event.

@Joseph
I can compare the two because they’re both scapegoats used to create what’s basically a force of evil. It’s not about the fine differences in legality or rights, it’s about the morality, something much more important. That worked to manipulate the dumbest part of society into aggression then, this works now. When you stop treating people like human beings for any reasons other than the choices they make (and no, illegal border crossing is usually not a vile choice, the vile thing in this case is the border itself), you quickly stop being one yourself. You’d think that with a history like yours you guys would be a little more inclined to remember that.

The “unlawfully” applies to those coming. My bad, poor word arrangement.

There are no other circumstances, you have a government militia coming for someone who’s in your country legally. Hell, a citizen like (presumably) yourself. That’s it. Is that person (perhaps you) entitled to use a gun?

@Luke
It’s not about morality; it’s about the law of the land. As a US citizen I cannot illegally enter Mexico, Canada, Europe, or many other places. I can, but if caught I’d be detained and deported. In some places, I’d be fined. When it comes to the United States, we’re supposed to welcome anyone who enters illegally simply because we are a nation of immigrants. We’re supposed to be a nation without borders surrounded by countries with borders.

@Luke
“There are no other circumstances, you have a government militia coming for someone who’s in your country legally. Hell, a citizen like (presumably) yourself. That’s it. Is that person (perhaps you) entitled to use a gun?”

Am I in fear for my life? If the answer is yes, I believe deadly force might be appropriate. Are they simply looking to detain me for whatever reason? If the answer is yes, I don’t think deadly force would be appropriate.

@Joseph
It is about morality. Laws change, objective criteria for human do not. Laws are basically trends.

From a different standpoint, your country was founded on breaking the laws of the land.

I never said all other countries should have borders. I see borders as something evil created by evil people. Try thinking outside of the political box on this one. In fact, try thinking outside of the political box in general. Cooperation = peace. Rivalry = war. It really is that simple.

I don’t know if you’re in fear for your life, only you know that. I’m guessing plenty of people detained by this ICE contraption were in fear for theirs. Especially the ones who know history. And you don’t know why they’re coming for you. Just like most of the the people they detained.

But here’s your inconsistency: you want this to be about law, yet you’re willing to abandon that law when it doesn’t suit you.

“your country was founded on breaking the laws of the land.”

In what way? Are we talking about how you think the country was stolen, or are we talking about how this country fought against the established legal and political order of the British Empire?

“I don’t know if you’re in fear for your life, only you know that. I’m guessing plenty of people detained by this ICE contraption were in fear for theirs. Especially the ones who know history. And you don’t know why they’re coming for you. Just like most of the the people they detained.”

Are they in fear for their lives or are they more in fear of being detained and deported? If police are attempting to arrest a criminal, does that criminal have the right to attack the police officer because they’re afraid of going to jail?

Ever notice how often the socialist aligned commentators on here will justify their arguments by falling back on Godwin’s Law when they are unable to intelligently discuss their views?

I personally don’t care if he protests or not Him protesting has nothing to do with his ability to entertain or not entertain people while he is in a ring

Ever notice how often the dumbest commentators on here will say plenty with no substance or objective whatsoever and not even attempt to rebuke whatever it is they think they oppose when they are unable to intelligently discuss whatever views align with their idols?

DB, you want to be a part of this conversation? Great, here’s a challenge. You just brought socialism into this for some reason, so please explain to me (preferably in your own words, although I’m not sure you have any) what makes capitalism better.

Or you can avoid it like a coward and say more nothings. Your call. I’m sure I’ll be amused either way. The only way you can stop amusing me is to shut up, but we both know that’s not gonna happen…

@Joseph
I’m talking about how the settlers didn’t care about the laws of the land. This is why your immigration crackdown is so hilarious, it’s pure hypocrisy. Trump’s own grandfather didn’t emigrate legally. I’m also willing to bet most if not all of the people who signed off on this have an illegal alien ancestor. Chances are you do as well, whether you know it or not.

But that’s not what’s important. What I’m trying to make you realize is that it’s a political vehicle designed to divide and dumb down your country, not one to make it better. Spreading fear always ends the same way.

And you tell me, you’re pro guns, I think people are too stupid to have firecrackers. But we’re not talking about criminals here, we’re talking about people not guilty of anything.

“I’m talking about how the settlers didn’t care about the laws of the land. This is why your immigration crackdown is so hilarious, it’s pure hypocrisy.”

Before that the Immigration Act of 1882 immigration was unregulated at the federal level. Before that, what law of the land are we talking about?

“Trump’s own grandfather didn’t emigrate legally.”

Donald Trump’s grandfather, Frederick Trump, did not immigrate legally to the United States initially. At 16, he left Germany without fulfilling the mandatory two-year military service required by Bavarian law, making his emigration illegal under those specific laws. He arrived in the U.S. in 1885. While his U.S. immigration was legal, his departure from Germany was not. Later, in 1905, he was denied re-entry to Germany and officially exiled due to his failure to fulfill military service and provide notice of his departure.

“But that’s not what’s important. What I’m trying to make you realize is that it’s a political vehicle designed to divide and dumb down your country, not one to make it better. Spreading fear always ends the same way.”

I agree it’s a political tool, just like every other topic that divides this nation. But spreading fear? Who is afraid? Who is in fear? The illegal immigrants who are breaking the law? I know I’m not afraid. To be honest I’m more afraid of these so-called peaceful protests where people are destroying stuff.

“And you tell me, you’re pro guns, I think people are too stupid to have firecrackers. But we’re not talking about criminals here, we’re talking about people not guilty of anything.”

They are guilty of immigrating here illegally. It’s as simple as that.

@Luke,
Well said and spot on all points.

Just so we’re all clear on a few things, and yes, this is going to be a lengthy reply. Writing the decision for an early challenge to U.S. Immigration laws, Justice John Jay (who by the way, was also a founding father and clearly would know the intentions of the writers regarding immigrants) said “We avoided, with great pains, the use of the word “citizens” in drafting the Constitution, and in it’s place, inserted “People”. We did this with the great hope and understanding that if we extended the blanket of the constitution to those visiting this nation, other nations, in turn, would offer the same protection to our citizens visiting their nation.”

Contrary to what certain media outlets have claimed, immigrants, even those that overstayed their visas, are afforded the legal right to remedy the situation. What we have now is Trump reinstituting the orders from his previous years in office, which gives I.C.E unchecked power, namely the power to openly defy any and all court orders. For example, if someone in the country “illegally” is on trial for a felony crime, I.C.E. has the power granted by the president to walk in, arrest the individual, and deport them, even in the middle of said trial. I.C.E. has not only done this, but deported individuals attempting to remedy their immigration status.

@Joseph
The laws of the people inhabiting the land that no one bothered to ask about because it was much easier to just eradicate the savages. But again, this doesn’t matter here.

I’m guessing quite a bit of the people protesting are very much afraid. Private militias tend to have that effect on people, especially when they’re funded by the state.

That’s how protests work. Worthless people will take advantage of them to destroy because they’re too dumb to create. One of the reasons I don’t believe in peaceful protesting.

You keep missing the most important point. I’m talking about people who are there LEGALLY. Including US citizens. I’m not talking about illegal immigrants. I have no idea how much clearer I can make this. Maybe this will help: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detention_and_deportation_of_American_citizens_in_the_second_Trump_administration.

But I have a new question. Why do you support people you know are trying to divide your country?

@Disgruntled Jobber
This is why I compared ICE to SS, but you’ll always get some clueless moron screaming “Godwin’s Law” to try to sound like a scholar…

@Disgruntled Jobber

“Contrary to what certain media outlets have claimed, immigrants, even those that overstayed their visas, are afforded the legal right to remedy the situation.”

This is why I said I don’t agree with some of their tactics. Even if a person is an illegal immigrant, overstayed their visa, or they were involved in a crime, they have a legal right to remedy the situation. They have the right to due process. So even though I’m okay with them being deported for cause, I’m not okay with them being deported and denied their legal rights.

@Luke

“I’m guessing quite a bit of the people protesting are very much afraid. Private militias tend to have that effect on people, especially when they’re funded by the state.”

ICE agents are not a militia. They are a federal law enforcement agency like the FBI, DEA, and other agencies.

“You keep missing the most important point. I’m talking about people who are there LEGALLY. Including US citizens. I’m not talking about illegal immigrants. I have no idea how much clearer I can make this. Maybe this will help:”

I saw those before and yes, it’s sadly happening. Just like innocent people are arrested for crimes all the time. The best we can hope for is that they happen less frequently and when they do happen, their resolved quickly.

“But I have a new question. Why do you support people you know are trying to divide your country?”

Because I support legal immigration and I know I’m beating a dead drum here, but illegal immigration is against the law. I’m okay with every illegal immigrant coming back legally. I’m okay with any legal immigrant who tries to become a US citizen. What I am not okay with is anyone of them breaking the law and if you think that’s me dividing this country then so be it.

@Joseph
As was the SS. There are so many parallels between them it’s not even funny.

This is your outlook on life, to which you have every right. I didn’t say you were dividing the country, I said the people exploiting this matter are. That’s why I don’t understand why you support them, when you know they’re not doing this for the greater good but for their own benefit.

Also, you may want to research how people who try to emigrate to the States legally are treated at your embassies. I don’t think you have all the facts. For many, the illegal route is much less humiliating.

Is a certain someone on here who was dismissive of posting links, now posting a link like its back in vogue? This is hypocrisy at it’s finest. And to make it even more laughable, they are using wikipedia, which is not considered a reliable source, to defend their poorly argued positions. Not only that, they continue to use the Reductio ad Hitlerum fallacy in their posts.

This is both humorous and sad at the same time. Socialism in education destroys minds no matter where, even in Australia.